September 04, 2003

The other half of the nonsense is that those "developing countries" get a big fat PASS to do as they damn well please !!

A quibble, but nitrogen is not a poisonous gas. You will suffocate in a pure nitrogen atmosphere, but you will not be poisoned. It will be the lack of oxygen that kills you, not the abundance of nitrogen. The same would be true in a pure hyrogen/helium/C02/most any other gas atmosphere.

Nitrogen is good, though. You wouldn't want to live on a world with a pure oxygen atmosphere, because every spark would cause catastrophic fires.

But to support your rant, I think I read a report where some scientists were puzzled that the biomass of the Amazon rain forest wasn't decreasing as fast as as they thought it should be, given the amount of logging, burning, and other stupid practices going on down there.

Seems that the excess C02 in the atmosphere is causing the remaining vegetation in the rain forest to increase faster than it would otherwise. Like you say. Plants go nuts for the stuff.

People are still doing stupid things down there, but if we could throttle back a bit, and not go all the way back to a hunter gatherer ecology like the eco-nuts seem to want, Nature will go a long way to setting the balance herself.

Acidman, wander over and post a comment to David Appell's site. It's likely to be worth the trouble. He's a science writer. http://www.davidappell.com/

Even if there is global warming, it is far from proven that human activity influences climatic change. It just shows me that the eco weenies are convinced that the world revolves around them.

Nitrogen is an inert gas. I use it to purge explosive environments frequently. But if you breathe pure nitrogen for about two breaths, you're unconscious, then dead shortly thereafter.

POISONOUS? Naw. Not if you want to quibble. Just go breathe some and see what happens.

After two breaths, get back to me about poisons. We'll discuss the subject then.

So,...how big is yur chainsaw?
On my "developing" acreage I have a
2stroke, gas guzzling, smoke billowing, 29 inch bar sumbitch in my shed......trees fear me! Bbbbwwhuuuhhhhh!!!!! It's almost firewood season!!

Any eco-nut that believes the Japanese should dictate environmental policy has never been to Japan. They plasticwrap everything down to the smallest cracker, have damned all their rivers, cut down 99% of their forest, incinerate trash in the middle of the city, and have no qualms whatsoever about chucking cigarette butts and giant loogies onto a city sidewalk.

Global Warming = Bullshit.

That is all.

Oh no, don't go to Appell's site. You'll have to deal with 20 fucking emails a day from that quack if you do.

He's an eco-freal nut-job.

eco-freak, too.

Something that apparently is being lost in the rush to discuss the shaky pseudo-science that is global warming here.....

The second excerpt mentions that "the BUSH administration in 2001" withdrew from the Kyoto protocol. If memory serves, Gore initially 'enlisted' the US into said protocol while having no authority to do so- not far from me declaring that I'm now and forever in the Justice League of America and want to sit next to Wonder Woman at all the meetings. Further, this bogus initiative was voted down resoundingly in the Senate during the CLINTON administration. To say Bush had anything to do with this is absurd..... why not blame him for sinking the Achille Lauro while you're at it?

The thing about global warming, as Acidman knows, is that it's a conspiracy started by Hillary to keep her BJing husband in line. Check FreeRepublic if you don't believe me. It's well documented.

It's me again you gasbag. You again display your ignorance about environmental matters. Why do you do this? Is it just an easy topic about which you can display your verbal abuse? One which will attract comments from the stoopit, stoopit people who flock to your site to yell, 'jump'?

Now, I happen to know something about climate change. To assert, today, that it does not exist is pure ignorance. Or, in your case,
ideological stupidity.

Scientists know for certain that human activities are changing the composition of Earth's atmosphere. Increasing levels of greenhouse gases, like carbon dioxide (CO2 ), in the atmosphere since pre-industrial times have been well documented. There is no doubt this atmospheric buildup of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases is largely the result of human activities.

Read more on the EPA's website. Then come back and apologize for being such a redneck, know-nothing, loudmouthed rube.

Um, no, scientists do not know for certain - that can be derived from the fact that not all scientists agree.

Greenhouse gasses are emitted by things other than human activity; volcanos and cattle are just 2 such things (okay, I will submit that there wouldn't be so many cattle if humans did not herd them).

There are also vast fields of natural gas (methane) under the oceans that "erupt" and make their way to the atmosphere (one such incident is speculated as leading to the largest mass extinction ever - which happened before the dinosaurs roamed the earth, much less mankind).

Anyway, my main comment was that it was assumed that people of the US are stupid not to know the "correct" answer. When in fact they are probably just questioning the politically correct answer and have yet to be convinced.

If the Japanese and French are more misinformed than Americans, then how can they serve as our concscience?

Bogie makes one of most common mistakes of understanding in the whole global warming/climate change debate. And, yes, every serious scientist and every serious group studying the phenomena do recognize it's a real problem. They DO NOT agree why it's happening. It's important to distinguish between the two. Ranters seldom do.

It's not hard to research. Do a Google on climate change. When you minimize the phenomena, you dismiss and devalue those, in Africa and elsewhere whose crops have failed years in a row, Islanders whose land is disappearing as waters rise, children who die, in the thousands everyday, because of drought and the loss of drinking water.

These are real problems for real people. Only ugly Americans dismiss them in such a pin-headed way.

I love that Momabear--silly fat cow! She always chimes in with what she thinks is a pithy comment, usually about something she knows nothing about. For instance, the United States is responsible for 60% of the greenhouse gases. Who should reduce? The USA or third world polluters who don't contribute much as it is, or whose economies are not strong enough to withstand investment in technology necessary to reduce emission? The USA has the economy and the technology already, they just don't want to do it, and assholes like you whine, 'it's not fair." Jeez, Grow up. Take some responsibility. Do the right thing.

If you want to see what the Republican Bush administration thinks about climate change you can read more than you probably can here: http://www.climatescience.gov/Library/stratplan2003/nrc-presentations25aug2003/default.htm

It's time to polish up your act and join the world of responsible adults.

Have a nice day :-}

I came in here to get up on my Chemist soapbox about N2 not being a poison, but since Mommabear beat me to it I'll talk about bovine flatulence instead.

Yes, that's right friends....cow farts. Methane (the primary constituent in cow farts and swamp gas too) is a much more effective greenhouse gas than CO2. I don't remember the exact numbers, but methane is about ten times more effective in inducing global warming. Let's just shoot all the cows and have a cookout!

By the way, I'm happy you talked about photosynthesis Aman. I guess these envirofreaks were sleeping or high when the teacher talked about feedback mechanisms in high school. It has been conclusively proven that trees and such grow significantly faster in higher CO2 environments. And what do trees and such do when they grow faster you might ask? Why they consume much greater amounts of CO2 thereby regulating the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere.

I guess these doofuses never heard of long range climate fluctuations either. They work on about a thirty year scale. It was a lot colder when I was a kid (all the old farts say that) and it will get colder again in due course.

SHEESH!

/rant

Welcome back, Hopkinstroll.

Now, we all know that Dem Science Guyz have determined that CO2 might make the planet warmer.

And we're all willing to admit that People make CO2 (not just by breathin', either).

But, uh, this does not act as proof that "human action is making the planet hotter", let alone that such an effect is damaging.

Given that climate change occurs naturally, constantly and (for now, at least) unpredictably (little ice age? climactic optimum? Is this thing on?), it's very much a stretch to claim that Man Is Heating The Earth (And We're All Gonna Die).

"Do a google search" is neither good science nor good science reporting. (How about if I google search for "global warming skeptics" or "climate change debunking"? I guess that doesn't count, does it?)

(Crop failures for a few years in Africa? Obviously global warming. I mean, fuck, that COULDN'T HAPPEN without global warming, could it? No way. No cause but global warming caused by mankind could cause repeated crop failures in sub-Saharan Africa. God knows there were never drought cycles before man started burning fossil fuels.)

I am going to say something about the meat of the article, that Americans are uninformed about the environment. I'd wager that the "incorrect" answer given by most people involved aerosols and air conditioning.

This is likely by the design of the environmentalists themselves. They probably do not care that the average person confuses one of their "problems" with another. Ozone or global warming are both adequate bogies. It doesn't matter which one people fear as long as they listen to the green crazies.

I've always heard that UV generates its own ozone and that global warming has historically been good for humans.

Mr. Sigivald,
Tell me, what makes me a troll and you not? Because I'm not a member of the amen chorus? Are only intemperate, ignorant, journalist wannabe's allowed to post on Acidman's site? What is the definition of a 'troll' anyway?
You display your ignorance in your comment on my post. My whole point was that global warming IS happening, but there is disagreement about why. What about this don't you understand? IF you've already made up and closed your mind about GW, there really is no use replying to you. If you are open to learning about what obviously you don't know, a Google search is a quick and easy way to find information new to you.
For instance, a study from Cornell University I recently did a story about shows that certain plants, especially those on tundra, fail to set seed, are slow to germinate and do not thrive when exposed to only slightly raised temps, and increased exposure to ultra violet light. This has potential to impact significantly on wildlife and, if extrapolated to other species in other affected regions, could have a huge impact on agriculture. But, I suppose you don't find this important, you will continue to thrive on McDonalds, MTV and video games.

"POISONOUS? Naw. Not if you want to quibble. Just go breathe some and see what happens.

After two breaths, get back to me about poisons. We'll discuss the subject then. "

I did mention the part about suffocating if you were to try to breath pure nitrogen, didn't I? Suffocation, in my book, does fall into the catagory of Things That Are Bad.

But I'm a cantankerous old curmudgeon, myself, and you have to be precise about this stuff.

A poison is something that screws up your fundamental metabolic processes. Another gas, carbon monoxide, IS a poisonous gas, because the stuff gloms onto your red blood cells thousands of times more readily than oxygen, and doesn't let go. And it just takes small concentrations to kill you. THAT is what makes it a poison.

Nitrogen is harmless by itself. Even in your example, it still isn't nitrogen that kills you, it's lack of oxygen.

I flew the F-4 Phantom II in the Air Force for about 10 years. Every couple of years we had to go up in an altitude chamber to experience high altitude hypoxia. Above 10000 feet, the partial pressure of oxygen is too low, and you start to be degraded. Get up to 15 to 20000 feet, and you will lose consciousness quickly without supplimental oxygen. It's insidious, too, because you don't realize you are being debilitated.

But once you go on oxygen, the effects are reversed almost instantly. Same with breathing pure nitrogen. You might pass out, but if you quickly get oxygen again, you will have no ill effects.

Breath carbon monoxide for a period of time, and getting back on oxygen will do you no good, because your hemoglobin has been locked up, and the oxygen can't be absorbed.

THAT is an example of a poison.

Here endeth the lesson.

rob, sorry to confront you on this, but you're very, very wrong on global warming/climate change. I'm not surprised I guess that you should take such a Luddite attitude on this, given your pose as a curmudgeon. But there IS a scientific consensus on this. Even Bush's White House has come around. What, if anything, to do about it is the issue these days.

Acidman, I am afraid that you are going to have to apologize for your stance on climate change.

The pithy and reasoned commentary written here supporting the now-obvious danger of petroleum has certainly convinced me that my former opinions were not grounded in fact, but were simply manufactured by insidious corporations and a craven media.

To think that I once held the opinion that anthropogenic climate change is a highly politicized hypothesis based on imprecise field data and that scientists may not know everything that is needed to direct such a radical change in human lifestyle.

It is a good thing that the pending reduction in carbon dioxide emission will severely limit production and allow us to live as we were meant to be. That is, one with nature.

How silly I was.

Not only is Earth warming, but astronomers have detected warming trends on Mars and Neptune. While not conclusively proven yet, It is also suspected that Uranus and Pluto are warming. No one seems to know how we managed to get enough CO2 out there to cause these planets to warm up too.

Of course, it couldn't possibly have anything to do with a solar cycle of some sort. The Sun is natural after all.

The Earth has warmed and cooled countless times in its history, for reasons that are still unknown. Dinosaurs were around for 165 million years or so when Earth was much warmer than it is today. As a species we haven't quite made the 100,000 year mark yet. Get a grip Hopkins, wee'll probably survive until it cools off again. Then you can be concerned about all the glaciers coming down from the mountains and swallowing up Chicago.

Hopkins, you fucking dolt. The planet has been warming up since the last Little Ice Age ended in 1750. Until you actually know something, kindly shut your fucking cumdump.

Hopkins, you fucking dolt. The planet has been warming up since the last Little Ice Age ended in 1750. Until you actually know something, kindly shut your fucking cumdump.

Well, it did bear repeating, but still, sorry.

Everybody knows Uranus emits greenhouse gases.

</Bart Simpson>